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realteco
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Posted: 21 February 2007 at 8:07am | IP Logged Quote realteco

can anybody give me some information about FISH LEATHER TANNING .
It can be a link or book... thank you...
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kallenwe
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Posted: 21 February 2007 at 8:56am | IP Logged Quote kallenwe

Fish with scales (Carp, Salmon, etc.) or without (eels, catfish, etc.)?  Cold water fish can be a little tricky because the collagen is a little different and thus more sensitive to heat and chemcials, but in general fish are about as easy to tan as tanning gets.  Oddly, you must "unhair" them to get it right.  That outer layer of the skin (keratin) must got whether it is actually hair or not.  Perhaps "must go" is a bit over stated, but you get the idea.

The best book is the UN paperback on Chemistry and Technology of Novelty Skins, but it is out of print and has been for years.  Several journal articles have been published on fishskin tannages.  Of course eelskin, frogskin and similar scaleless fishskin leathers have been commercial for many years. 

The skins can be delicate, but because they are thin and low in fat, they are a breeze to tan. 



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mexgerber
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Posted: 21 February 2007 at 1:09pm | IP Logged Quote mexgerber

Soaking, liming and tanning for fish skins is made, more or less, in the same way you do for another skins. The biggest difference is in the liming where you can not use lime and sodium carbonate is normally used to supply a bit alkalinity but, as Waldo says, they should be handled very carefully and many process should be performed by hand or with small machinery.
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kanigel
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Posted: 21 February 2007 at 1:21pm | IP Logged Quote kanigel

At one point in the research for my book Faux Real, I talked with a fellow, Jim Bates, of an outfit called "Upscale Leather," 508-476-2501, who works with leather tanned from wolffish, salmon, and cod. I don't believe Mr. Bates knows much about tanning himself, but apparently gets the leather from Iceland, then has it made up into novelty items. This information is as of February 2005.

Robert Kanigel
Faux Real: Genuine Leather and 200 Years of Inspired Fakes
Joseph Henry Press, May 2007

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kallenwe
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Posted: 22 February 2007 at 6:29am | IP Logged Quote kallenwe

Each of the world leather magazines has carried major articles on fish leather in the past.  Pulling up these references in World Leather and Leather the International Journal could be a good starting place for someone looking for more contacts and references. 

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dengwja
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Posted: 22 February 2007 at 8:57pm | IP Logged Quote dengwja

some fish oil need not unhair , on the contrary side, need protecting the squama ! thhus the most important part is soaking and bating for open the fiber for better tannage fixation and high Ts of the tanned leather !

this is the cricial point from my understanding!

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zercas
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Posted: 22 February 2007 at 10:26pm | IP Logged Quote zercas

Hi Robert, how are you, long time no see

So, by May we can get your book? I am eager to reat it, I really would like to buy an autographed copy by you, you will have to tell me how to procced, please. Or would I have to wait until you have a presentation here, "south the border, down Mexico way" as the song goes. Congratulations.

Fish tanning is something that I have never done, I prefer them fried with garlic, "al mojo de ajo", like we say.

But on a serious note we have to consider that fish collagen has a lower hydroxiproline to stabilize it, thus is more delicate in swelling.

Regards

Zercas 



Edited by zercas on 22 February 2007 at 10:27pm
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erwinhusni
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Posted: 23 February 2007 at 9:52am | IP Logged Quote erwinhusni

realteco...

The formulation of tanning fish skin(formaldehyde)/sting ray:

Soaking:water 500%, CaOCL2 1% soak overnight(PH 9-10)
Liming:Water 300%,lime 4%,salt 2%(PH 12)(36 Hours)
Fleshing:-
Weigh the skin !

Deliming:Water 400%,Urea 2%,formic acid 0,5%(PH7,5)(45 minutes and soak overnight)
Bating:protease enzyme 1%(2 hours and soak overnight)
Degreasing:Water 100%,degreasing agent 2%(60 minutes)
Wash

Discolouration I:Water 400%,salt 20%,stir 10 minutes and move it from that liquor!
                  Water 200%,,salt 15%,stir 15 minutes
                  Natrium Bisulphite(NaHSO3) 3%,stir 60 minutes

Discolouration II:New Float
                  Water 100%,salt 10%,stir 70 minutes
                  Natrium Hipocloride(NaOCL)3%,stir 30 minutes
                  Natrium Bisulphite(NaHSO3)2,5,soak over night

Forlmaldehyde tanning:Water 200%
                        Natrium Sulphate(Glauber Salt)5% stir 5 minutes(PH5)
                        Natrium Asetat(NaCH3COOH)2% stir 120 minutes(PH4)Move 75% liquor
                        used water25%
                        Formalin 4-5% stir 4 hours
                       
                        Water 100%
                        Natrium Formiat(NaCOOH) 1% add 3 feeds@15 minutes
                        natrium Bicarbonate 1,5 % add 3 feeds@15 minutes,stir 120 minutes and soak overnight

anging over night

wash I: water(much of water)

Wash II: water 400 %,Natrium Sulphate(Na2SO4)1,5% stir 60 minutes

Retanning: Water 100%
           Formalin 2%,stir 10 minutes
           Glutaraldehyde 2% stir 60 minutes
           soap 0,25% stir 30 minutes
           Natrium Acetate(NaCH3COOH)1,2 %stir 40 minutes
           Natrium Bicarbonate(NahCo3)1% stir 40 minutes(PH 6,5)

Fatliquoring:Water 150%(70 Degrees)
              Fatliquor 8% stir 90 minutes
             
Dyes:Water 150%(60 Degrees),Dyestup 3%,ammonia2% stir 60 minutes
antifungi 0,05% stir 20 minutes

wash

Drying,softening,staking and give top coat...
Good Luck...



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kallenwe
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Posted: 23 February 2007 at 10:27am | IP Logged Quote kallenwe

Mexgerger, why aldehyde tan rather than chrome tan?  most of the fishskin leathers that I have seen have been chrome tanned.



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erwinhusni
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Posted: 23 February 2007 at 11:03am | IP Logged Quote erwinhusni

The use of the substance of the chrome tanner to stingray evidently not easy like use to livestock skin.
Stingray tended solider and the fibre composition of mutual overlaps resembled the cane work, hindered penetration of the tanner's substance in this skin.So as therefore, time that was used to achieve the maturity of skin tanning was longer.
To help penetration of the substance of the chrome tanner in stingray was used the drum of the proceeding process for 15 hours with the speed 12 rpm-15rpm.Possibly by this I chose to give the suggestion so that tanning is carried out with formalin.

                                                                     Regard

                                                                      Erwin



Edited by erwinhusni on 23 February 2007 at 11:05am


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